AI-GENERATED SUMMARY

Tuuri reframes the sin of abortion as an act of idolatry, where parents sacrifice God-owned children to the idols of career, family planning, convenience, and “personal peace and affluence”1. He delivers a stinging indictment against the “apostate church” for its silence, arguing that by failing to sound the warning as watchmen (Ezekiel 33), the church shares in the blood guiltiness and idolatry of the culture1. However, the message concludes with a focus on reconciliation, asserting that God’s judgments—though righteous and necessary—are often accompanied by grace intended to turn the people back to the covenant, as seen in Leviticus 26 and Ezekiel 162. The practical application is a call for the church to proclaim the “inviable standard” of God’s word regarding life while preaching the grace of the Covenant Mediator, Jesus Christ, to bring about repentance2.

SERMON TRANSCRIPT

# Sermon Transcript: Ezekiel 16 – Sin, Judgment, and Grace
Pastor Dennis Tuuri, Reformation Covenant Church

Last week we talked about the inevitability of judgment in a world marked by sin. In a world that is decidedly marked by the fall and by resultant strife, quarrels and bloodshed, resulting judgments are to a certain degree inevitable. And we know that it would be grave error to see these judgments or to look at our world in isolation from the person of God, their creator and sustainer.

Because of this and because of sin, God’s judgments are also inevitable in our world. God is a judge and he evaluates the actions of man and passes temporal and eternal judgments. One of the duties of the church as God’s people in its prophetic office is to proclaim God’s judgments in the world—God’s evaluations of men and nations and his resultant actions. The passage that we’ve just read from God’s holy inspired word is emphatically a passage of judgment.

It’s a passage in which God, through the prophetic voice of Ezekiel, evaluates the actions of his covenant people and in which God announces certain actions or judgments that will take place upon those people. Now these particular verses which we have just read begin with a description of the sins for which God’s judgments must come. In this portion of the passage—chapter 16, verse 36 and the larger context of verses 15-34 of this chapter and verses 44-58—we see God’s evaluation of the actions of the people which have been the recipients of his grace in the beginning of the chapter.

In the passage of scripture we’ve just read as an encapsulation, I think, of the entire chapter. And so we have the same basic pattern in these verses that we see in the entire chapter which begin with God’s gracious saving of his people. Now, after these actions are evaluated and found sorely wanting in God’s sight, he pronounces his judgments upon the people in verses 37-43. As we have just read, these judgments are, while completely just and righteous altogether, nonetheless terrifying and powerful.

So, this passage that we have just read is certainly a passage of judgment, but it’s much more than that, for it concludes—as does the rest of the chapter—with the grace of God extended to a rebellious and wicked people made repentant by that judgment. Even in this portion of the text, however, we do see the judgment of God in that his grace is extended covenantally to the people on the basis of the work of the covenant mediator to come.

Jesus Christ’s propitiation and redemption were offered to satisfy the justice of God. And only on this judicial basis do we stand in covenant grace being evaluated by God not for what we intrinsically are nor on the basis of what we do ultimately, but for what we are in Jesus Christ our covenant mediator. Let’s spend a few minutes now looking at this passage of scripture and examining the details of the three elements of the passage before us.

These elements being the sin of the woman or God’s evaluation of his covenant people’s actions, the judgment of God or his righteous action in retribution for their being found wanting in the scales of justice, and finally the grace of God or his gracious extension of the merits of the covenant mediator to his elect people. So in these passages we have the sin of the woman, the judgment of God, and then the grace of God.

**First, the sin of the woman.**

If the judgments which we have just read frighten and alarm us, surely the sins of the woman must horrify and disgust us. I’ve chosen this particular passage today because I think it gives us insight into the problems that we face in this nation. The official declaration, as it were, of God’s evaluation of the woman began with a recitation of the crimes for which she has been found guilty and which will be the wellspring for her judgments.

In verse 36, we are told that the woman’s sin consists of two parts: first of all, idolatry. Idolatry is the false worship of anything other than God, of created beings and other things. But to worship anything other than God is idolatry. Actions—the actions of the woman in this case—are evaluated as idolatrous in nature. It is important to recognize that our worship of God therefore is vitally linked to our actions in this world.

God can evaluate the actions of the woman and find her guilty of idolatrous worship of other gods. The second part of the nature of the crime of which God finds her guilty is infanticide. Now it’s curious here to note that our judge singles out the sin of murdering her own children from the sin of idolatry, when it’s clear that the idolatry itself was the basis for this horrendous crime. In verses 20 and 21 of the passage, we’re told that the woman had taken children that were born for God, had sacrificed them unto idols to be devoured by them, and that she has caused them—that is, the children of God—to be slain or to be butchered, and also to pass through fires unto the idols in consecration and dedication to these idols.

That this was the end result of her idolatrous harlotries is also evident from the text before us. The chapter opens with the woman being found by God and being lovingly cared for and provided for by God when no other would have her. We’ve referred to this passage before in this church. You’ll remember that Ezekiel 16 begins with the woman being, as it were, a baby left after it’s born by its parents to die.

She is, in a sense, an old covenant baby Jane Doe, as it were, left to die by her parents. All the markings of sanitation and antiseptic purity that we find in our modern hospitals, while different in the external trappings from this portion of scripture, nonetheless should never disguise to us their horrible cruelty in which babies are butchered and starved to death in them. The verses that follow the opening portions of the scripture in this passage give us a progression first of God’s blessing upon the woman.

These blessings are elicited in the next fifteen verses as, first of all, life, love from God, clothing, jewelry, food, prosperity, and finally a kingdom in verse 13. There’s a progression of God’s blessings here upon the woman chosen on the basis of God’s grace. But this progression of blessings becomes a progression of idolatries when the woman begins her descent by trusting her beauty in verse 15. Verses 15-21 of the chapter depict the harlot now using all the gifts and blessings of God as vessels of idolatry.

The clothes in verses 16, the jewelry in verse 17, the brighter garments in verse 18, and oil, incense, flour, and honey in verse 19. All these gifts of God she has now turned into vessels of idolatry. And finally, the capstone of her idolatry, the sacrifice of her covenant children—God’s children—in verses 20 and 21. I note some lessons from this passage then in this progression of idolatry: first, from trusting in her own beauty to the result and capstone of her idolatry being the slaughter of children.

Note this dangerous progression of idolatry. What begins as a small thing with no outward manifestation—the trusting of her own beauty in verse 15—leads quickly and progressively to the horrendous sacrifice, the very fruit of her own body, her children. Check yourself as you hear this passage of scripture and as you read it. Root out any idolatry that lies in your life. Examine yourself to see if you be in the faith.

Don’t tolerate what may seem now to be a seemingly insignificant sinful act or a sinful area of idolatry in your own life. It will, if left undelt with, lead to your ruin and destruction. If mighty oaks from little acorns grow, then surely see how appalling and awful actions spring forth from small concealed sins. Know also the nature of this idolatry, who the idol is. The idolatry begins not with the temptation of a foreign god.

No, the idolatry begins with a woman trusting in her own beauty itself, the gift of God. The images that she ends up sacrificing her very children to—and I believe that murder is clearly taught in this passage of scripture—these images are made by the woman herself. They are the work and product of her hands. In an idolatrous mockery of the truth that we are the workmanship of God created by his hands, she now declares herself to be God, as it were.

Trusting in her own providence, trusting in her own ability, worshiping her own creations, and attempting to bring all of her life under her own dominion apart from God. Check yourself as you hear this passage of scripture. What is your source of trust and confidence as we meet this day? Your arm of strength or the arm of the Lord? What’s your source for the best way to handle situations that occur in our families and in our nation?

Your own mind or the mind of God as revealed in his holy word? What’s your source of security and safety? Your home, your gold, your guns, or the providence of our God and Savior? What’s your source of eternal security? Your own good works, your Christian upbringing, your attendance to church, or the Lord Jesus Christ, his doings and dying. Let not the wise man boast in his wisdom. Let not the mighty man boast of his might.

Let not the rich man boast of his riches. But let him that boasts do so in this, that he understands and knows me, God says—that I am the Lord that exercises loving kindness, justice, and righteousness on earth. For I delight in these things. Now, a man would have to be deaf, dumb, blind, and stupid not to see some rather obvious lessons for our nations in this passage we have before us. We have a people begun in covenant with Almighty God in this country, and reaped the great blessings of that covenant for so many years.

We have now come, as did Israel of old, to trust in those blessings, in that wisdom, in that arm of strength, and yes, in those riches that God has given to us. And once we begin trusting in them, they become the idol to which we would bring our children eventually in sacrifice and dedication. Our children walk no more in the godly homes and churches for the tender period of their upbringing and of their youth, but now are raised in the public schools that at first looked very much in educational content like those homes, but finally have reached the appalling height of godlessness that causes me to wonder how anybody in his right mind could send Johnny and Mary off to the public schools where God is openly and brazenly forbidden to be taught, except perhaps as some sort of cultural anomaly.

But as we said earlier, idolatry has its progression, and the idols we have constructed are not content with butchered minds and souls, but now call forth for butchered bodies as well and get them. Make no mistake about it, the children whose murders we bemoan this day in commemoration of the Roe v. Wade decision and the legalization of abortion—these children have been sacrificed to idols, and they’re the same old idols that this passage of scripture tells us about.

The woman whose pre-born child is seen as a threat to her career and so submits that child to the abortionist’s suction hose is an idolater, and she has handed over a child owned by God, his creator, to that idol to be devoured. The parents who for the sake of family planning and total control over their own lives turned their pre-born children over to the abortionist’s saline solution is an idolater, and they have handed over God’s creation of life to that idol to be burned.

The girl who sees her child as just an unwanted result of a night of pleasure and so turns the pre-born child over to the abortionist’s scalpel is an idolater and has handed over God’s child to that idol to be butchered. And the apostate church that sits quietly by talking of the need for tolerance and understanding, positing a supposed grace that ignores the murderous, unrepenting hands that take the communion cup, debating the supposed thorny issues and yes, what about the cases of rape and incest?

That church which refuses to take God’s word at face value in evaluating these situations because God’s judgments seem harsh and cruel, that church is also idolatrous. And because it did not sound out any call—and certainly not the clear call of the holy scriptures that pronounce God’s judgment upon such actions—because it did not sound the warning to the nation, the blood guiltiness is on its hands as well. The church has the prophetic ministry as we said earlier: proclaiming the inviable standard of God’s holy word. And when she does not do that, she is idolatrous and shares in the judgments which she has failed to proclaim.

Ezekiel 33:6 tells us: “But if the watchman sees the sword come and blows not the trumpet, and the people be not warned, if the sword come and take any person from among them, he is taken away in his iniquity. But his blood shall I require at the watchman’s hand.” Every year, millions of pre-born infants are sacrificed to the idols of women’s liberation, careers, family planning, personal peace and affluence, whoredom, convenience, physical fitness, and much more. These are idols, and they are idols of destruction in that they lead to death and decay. But they are also idols for destruction because the verses before us in Ezekiel, while they speak of the idolatrous sin of the woman, also speak of a certainty of God’s judgment upon her.

**The judgment of God.**

That judgment is consistent with the oft-stated principle of justice throughout the scriptures, namely that the manner in which the woman has sinned will dictate the manner in which judgment comes. Verse 38 of this passage tells us that since she has broken wedlock and shed blood, she will be given blood—her own, that is—and in fury and jealousy. Verse 43 tells us that since she has not remembered the days of her youth, God will recompense her way upon her blood, blood for blood as in verse 38.

Jeremiah 7:31 and 32 mention the very places where the children are sacrificed to Molech, the valleys of Tophet and Hinnom. These valleys, it is said, will now be called valleys of slaughter because the bodies of God’s people that he slaughters in judgment will be buried in those places. Just recompense upon their head for the sacrifice of their own children. Note here how the woman has brought God’s judgment upon herself in kind because she has not acted in kind to God.

God calls her to remembrance of her former days. He reminds her of the grace shown to her by him. She was left to die and he saved her. She was left bloodied in the first portion of the chapter and he washed her. She was left naked and he clothed her. And yet she takes her children—more correctly, God’s children—and does not extend the grace shown to her to them, but rather delivers them to be stripped, bloodied, and killed.

Will any find fault with God for this righteous judgment of his upon an idolatrous and murderous woman? Verse 45 tells us that the woman loathed her husband and children. And we could spend a lot of time talking about that passage alone someday, but maybe another day. But the Hebrew word here for loathe is only found ten times in the scripture. And five of those occurrences occur in the 26th chapter of the book of Leviticus, which are relevant to what we’re saying here.

In a parallel fashion to what we have just seen in Ezekiel, God says in Leviticus 26 that he makes his people fruitful. He takes them into covenant relationship with him. He gives them blessings and that he will not, in verse 11, abhor or loathe them. But verse 15 of Leviticus 26 says that they then abhor or loathe his commandments. And when that happens, judgment will come upon them, specifically, that God will, in verse 30 of that portion of scripture, abhor or loathe them.

And so God’s judgments are righteous and true altogether. One of our purposes this morning is to declare the certainty of God’s judgments upon idolators and murderers of children and to call upon God’s people to rejoice in these judgments, not vengefully, but in joy in the manifestation of God’s actions in history to make known his purposes and his justice. Judgment is coming upon this land. Make no mistake about it.

This nation has walked in idolatry for many years. And when a nation finally moves in that idolatry toward the murder of its helpless ones, its children, God’s judgment is near at hand. His ears are not deaf. They hear the cries both of the murdered children and of his faithful people. It’s our duty to sound forth the cry alerting the nation of God’s impending judgment and to use all of our lives to move this nation to a position of repentance before God.

Thirteen years ago, the highest court in the country in effect encouraged the murder of millions of pre-born children. The court continues to affirm this decision to this very day and so joins the ranks of history’s mass murderers. This church is owned by God and has been called into existence to proclaim his word as a light to the nations. It would be remiss of us and sin to fail to warn the country, the court, and the civil authorities of their violation of God’s holy word and his resulting judgments.

Having sounded the warning to that court and to the participants in the slaughter, it is appropriate that we affirm the judgments of God as revealed to us in holy writ. We concur with them and are under obligation to so concur. We seek righteousness in this nation and believe that God’s judgments may, in his providence, be the vehicle that will further that righteousness. And we have hope from the text before us to so concur and believe.

**The grace of God.**

For while this passage tells us pointedly about the sin of the woman and the certainty of God’s judgments, it also tells us of the wondrous grace of God in those very judgments. Our passage ends—as does the chapter—with the pacification of God’s anger and the gracious result of his judgments. The woman who was brought back to remembrance of her former days in verse 63 of this chapter is brought back to the covenant standing that she had known with God before her sin.

Verse 60 speaks to this. This same pattern is repeated in Leviticus 26 with the word we mentioned before—of loathing in that particular passage of scripture. Verses 44 and 45 of that passage say that while his people abhorred or loathed his statutes, yet God did not loathe them as to destroy them utterly. These are words of great grace and comfort to us today as we meet in God’s presence. God’s judgments in these cases are seen as unto restoration and not unto destruction.

And that’s our prayer for our nation. We are entrusted with the ministry of reconciliation. And that is part of what we preach this morning as well. Jesus Christ has come as the great covenant keeper. And because of his work on the cross—because he has suffered all the wrath that the just judge has to pour out on sinful man—God’s judgments toward man are accompanied by grace. We have a duty to proclaim the inviable standard of God’s word and to tell the nation of his ownership of these children that they are slaughtering in their idolatry.

We must tell them of their sin and of the judgment of God upon them, and we must concur in that judgment, for it is altogether holy and righteous. But our message must also preach the grace of our covenant mediator, Jesus Christ, and how that grace is mediated through these very judgments, so that men will turn in repentance and faith, embracing the covenant God who claims them for his own.

Let’s pray.

Almighty God, we pray that you would bless this church as we seek to proclaim forth your holy word and that you would, Lord God, through your judgments turn this nation again away from her harlotries, her idolatries, and her murders back to a position of true repentance and faith in you and of seeing our laws as reflecting the law of Jesus Christ. Help us, Lord God, to pray for this in our families, to teach this in our churches, to talk about this in our places of work, and to work toward this as we raise our children to be vehicles of the preaching of that word of reconciliation and judgment upon sin that you have given us. In Jesus’ name we pray. Amen.

Brethren, in the early church there was a godly discipline that such persons as stood convicted of notorious sin were put to public repentance and punished in this world that their souls might be saved in the day of the Lord and that others admonished by their example might be the more afraid to offend. But that discipline is sadly lacking in our day. And until such discipline is restored again—which is much to be desired—it is thought good that at this time should be read the general sentences of God’s cursing against impenitent sinners gathered out of the 27th chapter of Deuteronomy and other places in scripture, and that you should answer to every sentence, “Amen,” to the intent that being admonished of the great indignation of God against sinners, you may the rather be moved to earnest and true repentance and may walk more warily in these dangerous days, fleeing from such vices for which you affirm with your own mouths the curses of God to be due.

Cursed is the man that maketh any carved or molten image to worship it. Amen.

Cursed is he that curses his father or mother.

Cursed is he that removes his neighbor’s landmark.

Cursed is he that makes the blind to go out of his way.

Cursed is he that perverts the judgment of the stranger, the fatherless, and the widow.

Cursed is he that smites his neighbor secretly.

Cursed is he that lies with his neighbor’s wife.

Cursed is he that takes a reward to slay the innocent.

Cursed is he that puts his trust in man and makes man for his defense and in his heart goes from the Lord.

Cursed are the unmerciful, fornicators and adulterers, covetous persons, idolators, slanderers, drunkards, and extortioners.

Now, seeing that all who do hear and go astray from the commandments of God are accursed, let us return unto the Lord our God with all contrition and meekness of heart, lamenting our sinful life, acknowledging and confessing our offenses, the sins of our nation, and seeking to bring forth worthy fruits of repentance.

For now is the axe put at the root of the tree, so that every tree that does not bring forth good fruit is hewn down and cast into the fire. It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God. He shall pour down rain upon the sinners: snares, fire, and brimstone, storm and tempest. This shall be their portion to drink. For behold, the Lord has come out of his place to visit the wickedness of such as dwell upon the earth.

But who may abide the day of his coming? Who shall be able to endure when he appears? His fan is in his hand, and he will purge the floor and gather his wheat into the barn, but he will burn the chaff with unquenchable fire. Turn you then, and you shall live. Although we have sinned, yet have we an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ, the righteous, and he is the propitiation for our sins. For he was wounded for our transgressions and smitten for our wickedness.

Let us therefore return unto him, the merciful receiver of all true penitent sinners. Assuring ourselves that he is ready to receive us and most willing to pardon us if we come unto him with faithful repentance, if we submit ourselves unto him, and from henceforth walk in his ways, if we will take his easy yoke and light burden upon us to follow him in meekness, patience, and charity, and be governed by the word of his holy spirit, seeking always his glory and serving him duly in our vocation with thanksgiving.

If we do this, Christ will deliver us from the curses of the law and from the extreme malediction which shall fall upon them that shall be set on the left hand, and he will set us on his right hand and give us the gracious benediction of his father, commanding us to take possession of his glorious kingdom, unto which he promises to bring us all for his infinite mercy.

Let us pray.

Lord God, almighty and everlasting father, we acknowledge and confess before your holy majesty that we are poor sinners born in corruption, inclined to evil and unable by ourselves to do good. And that every day and in many ways we transgress your holy commandments, thus calling upon ourselves your just judgment, condemnation, and death. We further confess, Almighty God, that we live in a sinful nation that annually murders millions of unborn children. We moan and bewail this wicked slaughter and repudiate this evil, together with all who commit such crimes, with all our heart. O Lord, we are grieved because we, along with our nation, have offended you.

We condemn ourselves and our sins in solemn repentance. We turn again to your grace and implore you to succor us in our distress. Have pity upon us, gracious God, Father of mercies, and pardon our sins for the love of Jesus Christ, your son, our savior. Grant to us and increase in us continually the graces of your Holy Spirit, so that acknowledging our faults more and more, we may grieve over them and renounce them with all our heart, and may bear the fruits of righteousness and holiness which may be well pleasing in your sight through Jesus Christ our Lord. Amen.

Dearly beloved, our Lord Jesus Christ has assured us that his church is built upon himself, the rock, and that the gates of hell shall never prevail against it. To his church, he has committed the keys of the kingdom of heaven, saying, “Whatever you shall bind on earth shall have been bound in heaven, and whatever you shall loose on earth shall have been loosed in heaven.” In the book of Revelation, the office bearers of the church are called the angels of the churches.

And in the eighth chapter of that book, these office bearers are shown blowing the trumpets of the word of God. As the office bearers proclaim the word of God, signified by these trumpets, and as the people of God pray for salvation, signified by incense that ascends to heaven, God is faithful and pours out fiery wrath upon his and their enemies upon the earth. Today, I bring before you the many men and women in this country who annually murder over one million pre-born infants through the heinous sin of abortion.

I ask you to join with me in praying that God will pour out his wrath upon them and upon all in alliance with them in this sinful act. When I have prayed God to deal with them, I shall ask the congregation to join me in solemn amen.

Let us pray.

Almighty and most terrible God, judge of all men living and dead. I bring before you the many men and women now living who have this year and in years past murdered millions of pre-born infants who have attacked your integrity by denying your image in man. I, as your anointed office bearer, now ask that you place your special curse upon these people and upon all in alliance with them. I ask you to pour out the fire of your wrath upon them and destroy them, that this awful butchery might forever cease in this world and that your church may be free to pursue the advancement of your kingdom.

I ask that you visibly and swiftly vindicate the absolute righteousness of your holy law and the government of your only son Jesus Christ, our Lord, who lives and reigns with you and the Holy Spirit, ever one God, world without end. Amen.

Congregation of the Lord Jesus Christ, do you join with me in asking God to visit his wrath upon these people? If so, answer amen.

Amen.

Show Full Transcript (27,443 characters)
Collapse Transcript

COMMUNION HOMILY

No communion homily recorded.

Q&A SESSION

Q1

Questioner: Howard L., you know, sounded like you had most of that written out. Would you be able to give out copies to people?

Pastor Tuuri: Sure. Yeah. I’ll bring a couple copies next week, John. Probably some of the statements that Christian churches have made on abortions, particularly those that see it as a responsibility—that might sound too—church.

John S.: John’s point is that he was reading, for instance, this last week the 1983 statement by the Presbyterian Church in USA where they said that abortion is part of one’s covenantal responsibilities.

Pastor Tuuri: Is that what it said?

John S.: As good stewardship.

Pastor Tuuri: See, that’s a good point because I know that big red little red back in the 1700s when they said a sermon or they preached a sermon that was publicly printed in the newspapers—sometimes. At least it was common practice to do that. It wasn’t seen as taboo to print a sermon. I mean, that kind of thing put in print as an advertisement would be powerful. Yeah.

Well, in fact, I had planned to—well, I hadn’t planned to. I thought about a week ago taking an ad out in the Oregonian for this Sunday’s service, and I just wasn’t quite ready to do it for a lot of different reasons. But when I checked the ads in the church section of the Saturday Oregonian, I didn’t see a single reference either in the advertisements nor in the reporting about Human Life Sunday.

I thought, well, next year we certainly should do that. We should take out a fairly good size ad and use it as an educational tool of some sort.

Q2

Questioner: Dan

Pastor Tuuri: Well, I haven’t read the Sunday paper. What I was talking about was the religious section of the Saturday paper where they always talk about what’s going to happen on Sunday, you know, in various churches. There wasn’t anything in there and I was real disappointed that was the case.

Sure. Yeah. I think that, you know, the situation in the media today—we’re going to have to buy space, unfortunately.

Q3

Howard L.: You know, I was just glad that Super Bowl was this—you know, I’ve heard of churches having special early services. I guess it’s in Denver to people go home early. And you know, I was thinking of Human Life Sunday. How would the same day Super Bowl got more interest?

Pastor Tuuri: Yeah, I guess there’s a rally this afternoon at 2:00 in Salem sponsored by Oregon Right to Life Education Committee and they—I think they expect several thousand at that rally hopefully.

Howard L.: But I was sort of disappointed too that wasn’t a little later in the day but give people a chance to get down there, you know. Even a normal service gets out at mid or noon rather and I’m not sure how many people could have could get to it.

Q4

Questioner: I don’t know how but called for the curses, you know. You know, I’ve talked to different people who have said that up to a certain point in their life that they had, you know, denied God. They were not able to surrender to God and but they did, you know, through some of God or whatever, but anyway, they did surrender. Yeah. Now, when you call it now, I don’t know if you’re using it generalities or whatnot. Are you pro-that can take place or surround you later on or no?

Pastor Tuuri: That was what I tried to point out from the final portion of the passage before us—that even in the case that we read in Ezekiel, God’s judgment actually is part of the process whereby they do finally turn and repent of their evil ways and turn back to God.

So in terms of the nation, for instance, when the judgment of God comes upon the nation it will repent. In terms of individual lives, frequently when God’s judgment begins to manifest itself upon a person, they then will be brought to, you know, remembrance of what they’ve done in their sin. And so, actually, you know, first of all, no—we don’t say that people can’t be brought to repentance even if they’ve been abortionists, for instance. Certainly they can, and we pray that they would be. And secondly, we say that when we ask for God’s judgments upon those people on the basis of what the scriptures tell us, that’s part of the process normatively whereby they’ll be brought to that repentance.

The Catholic Church has, I believe, a sentence that it pronounce—it can pronounce upon people that implies or actually states that the person cannot repent from that point on. I don’t believe there’s any such biblical warrant for that kind of action. Even when an excommunication takes place, for instance, you still—the difference between the church’s final judgment as it were, in terms of excommunication, as opposed to the state—that the person remains alive and hopefully the church still is in a ministry of reconciliation and that person will be brought back to repentance through the very act of excommunication and being cut off.

So no, we always see the grace of God. And that was the third point I tried to stress—although I didn’t really spend as much time on it, maybe, as I should have.

Q5

Questioner: So you mean somebody who’s had an abortion could essentially, even though they can technically be dead under a biblical form of government, they could be brought back?

Pastor Tuuri: Yes. And most, some many people in the church are aware of this fact, but I’ll repeat it for those who aren’t: that the early church of course had to deal with those sort of problems. They had a situation where they knew that God’s laws which the civil magistrate should exercise against abortionists or those who participated in abortion was the death penalty. And yet the civil government wasn’t doing it. In fact, encouraging—just as our civil government is—abortions.

And so the early church had to struggle with the fact of what to do with people who had either had abortions or participated in them or even made drugs to be used by them. Those people once brought to repentance and faith in Jesus Christ—the church had to deal with: how do we deal with these people now?

And Rushdoony has done some work, some research in this area that apparently shows that some churches would bar them from the Lord’s table for a period of a year or seven years or some for life. Others would, on the basis simply of their faith and works shown in their lives, allow them to come to the table. In fact, Rushdoony goes so far as to say he thinks that’s the origin of the whole system of penance—is the inability, is the not inability, the unwillingness, the civil magistrate to execute God’s penalty. And therefore the church has faced people who haven’t had God’s wrath exercised on them by the civil magistrate the way that the civil magistrate should do.

And so, how now do we understand a person is truly repentant? And so, the church began a whole system of penance that involved various activities, which was of course perverted. But the point is that yes—those people who have committed abortions today, for instance, can be brought to repentance and faith in Jesus Christ, should be welcomed into the fold of the church upon that faith and repentance. And the church certainly is under obligation to make sure that there is true repentance and faith and to see some sort of works or some sort of evidence of that faith and repentance. But having seen that, the church is under obligation to accept them back into the fold of the church.

Q6

Keith: In regard to the gentleman’s question over here, first—excuse me—Second Kings chapter 21 and then 2 Chronicles 33. You get the account of Manasseh, king of Judah, who says sacrificed his own son in the fires and committed all kinds of detestable deeds. But in the second’s account it says that at the end of his life he repented and was granted—I think his kingdom was granted a short—so it is possible. That’s good. And I’m sure that members of our church who are heavily involved in the anti-abortion movement directly probably have various stories they could tell of people who have been brought to repentance who once were abortionists.

Q7

Questioner: Any other questions or comments? Yeah, any more—let’s say update—let’s say what’s happening with your child abuse?

Pastor Tuuri: Well, as I said in the announcement sheets today, there’s a meeting a week from tomorrow in Salem that has been called by Representative Schroeder to educate other representatives and senators on the child abuse issue. I’ll be at that meeting. There’ll be a number of people there who will—who will be at the meeting giving a good perspective on the issue. So I guess we’re kind of looking at that as the rallying point for bringing the various elements who are working on this thing separately together. And we’ll also use that time, hopefully, to sort of coordinate a plan of attack for what—how we’re going to approach it.

What we need to do obviously is get a bill introduced, a bill that will strike. And what my concern is that I don’t want a bill that’s going to, you know, deal with the edges of the problem. I think we have to attack the problem directly. And that’s why we prefer a bill with the new definition of child abuse that would cut right to the core of a lot of the other actions the CSD is taking.

Now, you’re—that this is, say, this is going through the parents education association?

Questioner: Yeah. When I’m actually at the meetings in Salem, I’ll be representing the parents education association. Although on the other hand, also, as I said before, I want to work with other pastors. What I’m waiting for in that area is I wrote a letter to Dr. Dobson the first part of last week, asking for his help—maybe just a simple letter of affirmation what we’re doing, something from him saying that he approves what we’re doing. And then I thought I’d wait for another week or two, see if I get a response. And that would give me a lot stronger hand when I go to other pastors in the Portland area if I have some sort of endorsement from Dobson.

And I frankly expect that because he has been highly involved in the child abuse thing for several years now. And in fact, because of that stand, he’s also taken against pornography. I understand that members of his family are undergoing threats of physical punishment which are very real, and there’s been several instances where people have tried to do damage to his children. So I think that he’ll help us in whatever way he can.

Q8

Questioner: What other type of support have you got from other—say pastors? Or—

Pastor Tuuri: Well, mostly the contact right now has been with individuals, not pastors, but individual people within congregations. And I don’t think that we will find—I hope we’ll find a good deal of support when I go to them directly to the pastors another couple of weeks. Right now though, the priority has been the legislative side because, you know, most—you know, the session only meets every two years in Oregon. It will last about 5 or 6 months. So right now is our window of opportunity.

Additionally, there’s a cut off date, and I believe it’s either like end of January or middle of February or something, for introduction of new bills. So we have to have a bill introduced fairly quickly in order to have it considered this session. So right now the stress is upon the introduction of legislation. And then the lobbying effort with other pastors and whatnot will have to take place after we’ve accomplished that introduction.

Q9

Roy: What’s the meeting about tomorrow?

Pastor Tuuri: Tomorrow night, it’s basically—well, originally it was going to be a group of non-Christian homeschoolers who wanted to hear about the new law and what legislation we were looking at this year and this kind of thing. Although then also I was called a couple of days ago, and there’ll be at least 10 pro-life people from another group entirely separate—who are Christians—who will be there also because they wanted to—they knew I was going to be speaking, so they wanted to come and hear what I had to say.

So I’m going to aim mostly at explaining the new law, talking about the dangers of the group that wants to repeal the law we passed two years ago, and then also I’ll give them an introduction to the child abuse thing and try to get them on board in terms of that issue. And there’ll probably be—I don’t know—at least 30, 40 people there hopefully, that will hopefully build workers then for what we do in this session.

Q10

Questioner: Richard, and the meeting tomorrow—it’s in going to be. I believe I got the directions at home. Maybe you give me a call. I’ll let you know where it’s going to be. What time is it?

Pastor Tuuri: I believe it’s 7:00.

Q11

Denny: Would it be possible to get an ad for next week—kind of this—like a news item? This message was delivered. No, it’s an idea.

Pastor Tuuri: Sure. A few of us could talk about that. I’m not sure. Yeah, I’m sure we could do it.

Questioner: The if you put the ad in the religious section, you get like a 50 or reduced rate. I don’t remember how much Howard might know.

Howard L.: Well, you know, advertising is expensive. For a very small ad for a church, it cost 35 bucks. Smallest ad you can get is an inch, right? And you can’t already see it. So, I mean, you know, for a good size ad, it’s about $250, $200, and that’s at church rates. And whether or not we would get that—how maybe you and Denny could kind of work on that. Would that be okay? You’ve got some experience with the Oregonian, don’t you?

Questioner: Paid up, I hope. John heard about it. Of course, the way of accident is always party. That was going to be a definite bill that was going to be coming up as introduced bill to take away status from that. No, I haven’t yet.

Q12

Questioner: Yeah, there’s also already a bill introduced that would prohibit discrimination against homosexuals in hiring practices and renting your house, this sort of thing. I would think that we ought to be able to use the AIDS thing in that area, you know. I mean, anyway, it’ll be a lot of terrible legislation, of course, coming into Salem. And it’s a good idea to—if each of us could—as we get aware of this stuff individually—write down the bill number, what the basic information is, then I could put on the announcements each week to help people know what’s going on. So you can call in to your representatives and senators.

Pastor Tuuri: Legislation. I don’t know. I don’t think I am. There is. Yeah. She wasn’t going to do it if she didn’t get enough money. So I don’t know. She went ahead and did it—50 bucks threw off doing that. What’s that information? I don’t know.

Q13

Tony: Yes, not related, but something of interest to me personally and me as president is this case in Tennessee where the fundamentalist families went to court and got a judgment in their favor on the right to have their children not taught in text that they chose. If anybody has any literature that’s been published on that by way of newsletter or something gives a blow-by-blow description of that particular event, I’d like to see it. Kind of good on such show.

Questioner: H—and that would be—you can’t get anything because of the press from what really happened.

Q14

Questioner: I have—I told Paul—speaking of the media—another thing in this child abuse thing that’s of interest is that I think I mentioned month or two ago, this couple of days after I preached on the last of my series on the child abuse talks when I dealt directly at the regulations. The next day or two in the Oregonian, there was a story about a family who had been investigated by CSD and were at fear. It was a fairly good story. So I wrote to the two reporters and told them I like the piece.

Well, many of you know this already, but I since been contacted by the lady the story was written about. We’ve had several conversations over the last week or two. She was given my name by one of the two reporters because he was upset because the Oregonian took the original article he wrote, cleaned it up to make CSD look better, waited a few weeks, and then printed it. And so he gave the original article he wrote to the lady for use, whatever she wants to do with it. And he also gave her my name to contact me.

Well, she now is preparing a packet of information, including the original Oregonian story, their edited story, and a bunch of letters from CSD regarding her case. And it makes them look real bad. And now she is going to go on a personal campaign here, down to I think just about every senator and representative in Salem with this packet of information and start working on from her end to show that here’s an example of a family that can just be ripped to pieces by this system.

As far as I know, the particular cause that they were—why they were investigated was their child was small. Remember we talked about that in the rules: that developmental problems can be a real threat to a parent. The reason in their particular case why the child was small—they’d adopted an Indian boy through an adoption agency in McMinnville who was born, I think, 3 or 4 months premature, had terrible health problems, and as a result, of course, doesn’t develop as fast as other children. And they were then hotline and CSD has been doing an investigation of them. So it’s a real—I mean, it’s a terrible thing to happen to the lady. On the other hand, it’s a very opportune thing to be coming out at this particular point in time with trying to introduce some bills in the legislature.

Additionally, she has a lot of information on the fact that the attorney general’s office, through a coordinating group in Multnomah County, are going to be introducing a whole series of child abuse pieces of legislation from the other side. They’re going to declare war on child abuse. You’re going to see it whipped up just like you did in this Oregon, the 1990s, whatever that report was. So there’s going to be a lot of stuff from the other side that we’re going to try to make it even worse than it is now in this state.

I just in the last week in the Valley Times, I read a story about the lady who was part of this Oregon in the 1990s, you know, that report. And she said, for instance, that there were 18,000 cases of child abuse in suspected child abuse in Oregon each year. And that for every person that was abused, you had three or four that were never are turned in. So the reader of that article in the LA Times gets the impression that there was between 50 and 75,000 cases of child abuse in Oregon every year.

When in point of fact, the 18,000 undoubtedly is the number of hotline calls that were made, 90 or 95% of which are cleared as being not cases of abuse. There’s one example of how they’re going to whip up this hysteria in this state now to try to make things far worse.

All the more reason why we have to get out there, understand Mary Pride’s book, understand the implications of it, talk it up to people, and get moving in a lobbying effort in the state.

Well, there any other questions or comments? If not, let’s go ahead and get downstairs and eat.